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Since: Feb 15, 2005 Posts: 46
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(Msg. 1) Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 4:52 am
Post subject: Standards and Sloppage and Long-Time Instructors Archived from groups: misc>fitness>aerobic (more info?)
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Have any of you ever had to deal with a long-time instructor who got
trained years ago, and isn't quite up on modern best practice?
I had an episode with a long-time instructor today. He was doing his
usual advanced step workout which faces all directions, with lots of leg
twists and jumping around. For what it's worth, most of his clientele
can handle all that (for now). But for my own part, I had to adapt the
jumping and radial leg maneuvers the way my doctor told me to. I
compensate for that stuff with added leg and arm weights.
What especially got the instructor's attention onto me was, he was off
the 32-count by one beat, and I was following the music, not him. Well,
duh, I couldn't always see him, but I could always hear the music.
To his credit, he came to me afterward and gently tried to tell me I was
off the beat, and maybe my ankle and wrist weights were throwing me off,
and ACE and AFAA consider them contraindicated. In return, I admitted
he might possibly be right about weights, but maintained he was the one
off the beat.
He questioned me what I thought the beat per minute was (which seems
irrlevant), and I guessed 132 bpm. He said, 138. In great surprise, I
said 138 bpm is contraindicated for a step class.
I know Usenet won't be deciding which of us was on the beat, but...
* Are strap-on weights really against the recommendations of fitness
organizations? I find that hard to believe, because I was trained as a
fitness instructor five years ago, I weighed fifteen pounds more then,
and I had ten pounds of strap-ons today.
* I'm sure that if the fitness organizations saw this guy, they'd have
him up on charges. But maybe lots of us lead workouts with more jumping
and higher speed than the organizations recommend. How much of slop is
there to the recommendations, given a room full of highly healthy people
taking an advanced class?
* Is there a gentle way to suggest that a long-time instructor go take
some refresher workshops, especially when he runs the gym and can get me
thrown out?
--
-------- Scott Eiler B{D> -------- http://www.eilertech.com/ --------
"Men must be patient. Cattle are not reasoning beings. Remember that
this is the Home of Mothers. Treat each cow as a Mother should be
treated."
- Notice To The Help, from W.D. Hoard, founder of Hoard's Dairyman
Magazine. >> Stay informed about: Standards and Sloppage and Long-Time Instructors |
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Since: May 25, 2004 Posts: 113
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(Msg. 2) Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 4:52 am
Post subject: Re: Standards and Sloppage and Long-Time Instructors [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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In article <bBcQd.9920$D34.4695@newssvr12.news.prodigy.com>, Scott
Eiler <seiler RemoveThis @eilertech.com> wrote:
> * Are strap-on weights really against the recommendations of fitness
> organizations?
Yes. There was a phase of time when folks were using them to add
intensity to their step workouts, until it was discovered that the
incidence of shoulder, elbow and knee injuries skyrocketed as a result.
It's now considered contraindicated. If you really want to add weight
while stepping, wear a weighted belt or a backpack with a sandbag in
it--something that won't get swung at the end of an appendage.
> * I'm sure that if the fitness organizations saw this guy, they'd have
> him up on charges. But maybe lots of us lead workouts with more jumping
> and higher speed than the organizations recommend. How much of slop is
> there to the recommendations, given a room full of highly healthy people
> taking an advanced class?
ACE and AFAA still recommend no more than 128 bpm as the highest BPM,
for healthy people in an advanced class.
Unfortunately, I would guess that more than half the step instructors
out there use tempos significantly higher, with the idea that "my
participants are advanced, they can do it." There has been a lot of
discussion about this over the years, but the research clearly showed a
degradation in form and therefore safety as tempos rose higher than
128. Folks also use smaller range of movement in order to complete the
movement in time, which reduces exertion and defeats the whole purpose
of increasing the tempo.
> * Is there a gentle way to suggest that a long-time instructor go take
> some refresher workshops, especially when he runs the gym and can get me
> thrown out?
If he's certified by ACE, AFAA or just about any other
nationally-recognized organization, he must earn continuing education
credits in order to renew his certification every two years. Ideally
he would pick up such information in the conference workshops and
classes he takes, but unfortunately this type of information isn't
stressed much. I'd suggest visiting ACE's (American Council on
Exercise) or AFAA's (Aerobics and Fitness Association of America)
website and looking up their step guidelines, then presenting him with
a printed copy.
--
Denise denise dot howard at comcast dot net
ACE and AFAA certified fitness instructor
AFAA step and kickboxing certified >> Stay informed about: Standards and Sloppage and Long-Time Instructors |
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Since: Feb 15, 2005 Posts: 46
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(Msg. 3) Posted: Sat Feb 19, 2005 4:56 am
Post subject: Re: Standards and Sloppage and Long-Time Instructors [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Denise Howard wrote:
> In article <bBcQd.9920$D34.4695@newssvr12.news.prodigy.com>, Scott
> Eiler <seiler.TakeThisOut@eilertech.com> wrote:
>
>>* Are strap-on weights really against the recommendations of fitness
>>organizations?
>
> Yes. There was a phase of time when folks were using them to add
> intensity to their step workouts, until it was discovered that the
> incidence of shoulder, elbow and knee injuries skyrocketed as a result.
> It's now considered contraindicated. If you really want to add weight
> while stepping, wear a weighted belt or a backpack with a sandbag in
> it--something that won't get swung at the end of an appendage.
Thanks for the info. It makes me think, maybe Usenet *can* be a fitness
disseminator.
>>* I'm sure that if the fitness organizations saw this guy, they'd have
>>him up on charges. But maybe lots of us lead workouts with more jumping
>>and higher speed than the organizations recommend. How much of slop is
>>there to the recommendations, given a room full of highly healthy people
>>taking an advanced class?
>
> ACE and AFAA still recommend no more than 128 bpm as the highest BPM,
> for healthy people in an advanced class.
Now, if only those long-time instructors could tap into this modern
fitness information...
>>* Is there a gentle way to suggest that a long-time instructor go take
>>some refresher workshops, especially when he runs the gym and can get me
>>thrown out?
>
> If he's certified by ACE, AFAA or just about any other
> nationally-recognized organization, he must earn continuing education
> credits in order to renew his certification every two years.
Yeah, I have to do that too. But they don't make me recertify what I
already learned from them, they just make me go to workshops or take
mail-in courses, on things just barely related to what I certified for.
In my own case, I used my mail-in knowledge of, among other things,
"Teenage Girls and Osteoporosis" for recertification.
I've been AFAA-certified for four years, and you've caught me in a
violation regarding strap-on weights. And you only did it because I was
willing to listen to a fellow fitness professional. How much more in
violation will I be after twenty years? How much more so, if I would
not listen to other fitness professionals?
> Ideally
> he would pick up such information in the conference workshops and
> classes he takes, but unfortunately this type of information isn't
> stressed much. I'd suggest visiting ACE's (American Council on
> Exercise) or AFAA's (Aerobics and Fitness Association of America)
> website and looking up their step guidelines, then presenting him with
> a printed copy.
That's a good suggestion for any fitness professional (me) who wants to
aid a fellow fitness professional (him) who might be willing to listen
to constructive criticism.
Unfortunately, I verbally tried this already. His response was, among
other things, "If I've been doing this wrong, I've been doing this wrong
for twenty years." His point being...?
If I give this guy a copy of fitness guidelines, with relevent points
highlighted, he'll probably go postal. And this guy runs my gym, so he
can expel me altogether.
He employs several talented professionals, but I'm almost certainly the
only certified fitness professional who works out with him and does not
take his paycheck. I kind of doubt the others will help give this guy
constructive criticism.
And it's a corporate fitness facility. The corporation is usually happy
to let us loose for lunch, but they are really, really grasping when it
comes to letting the engineers loose to go to some other gym for
scheduled classes at night. (My own career as an aerobics instructor
has come to an end that way, at least for now.) In short, if I want
professionally-taught aerobics instruction from my qualified peers, I'm
stuck with this place.
In short... maybe I can't get much constructive advice here, but at
least I can vent.
--
-------- Scott Eiler B{D> -------- http://www.eilertech.com/ --------
"Men must be patient. Cattle are not reasoning beings. Remember that
this is the Home of Mothers. Treat each cow as a Mother should be
treated."
- Notice To The Help, from W.D. Hoard, founder of Hoard's Dairyman
Magazine. >> Stay informed about: Standards and Sloppage and Long-Time Instructors |
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Since: May 25, 2004 Posts: 113
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(Msg. 4) Posted: Sat Feb 19, 2005 4:56 am
Post subject: Re: Standards and Sloppage and Long-Time Instructors [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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In article <d1xRd.14156$D34.8042@newssvr12.news.prodigy.com>, Scott
Eiler <seiler RemoveThis @eilertech.com> wrote:
> Thanks for the info. It makes me think, maybe Usenet *can* be a fitness
> disseminator.
We've been working on that idea in this newsgroup for ten years now!
> > ACE and AFAA still recommend no more than 128 bpm as the highest BPM,
> > for healthy people in an advanced class.
>
> Now, if only those long-time instructors could tap into this modern
> fitness information...
Tongue planted firmly in cheek, I detect....
> Yeah, I have to do that too. But they don't make me recertify what I
> already learned from them, they just make me go to workshops or take
> mail-in courses, on things just barely related to what I certified for.
> In my own case, I used my mail-in knowledge of, among other things,
> "Teenage Girls and Osteoporosis" for recertification.
Yes, it's unfortunate that it works this way. OTOH, certification is
intended as the beginning of one's fitness education rather than the
end, so it's good that they encourage us to keep learning.
> How much more in
> violation will I be after twenty years? How much more so, if I would
> not listen to other fitness professionals?
None, if you keep up on fitness trends and research. ACE's "Fitness
Matters" newsletter is actually pretty decent for this purpose. Much
better publication than AFAA's "American Fitness", which is pretty
fluffy.
> Unfortunately, I verbally tried this already. His response was, among
> other things, "If I've been doing this wrong, I've been doing this wrong
> for twenty years." His point being...?
There are some pretty big egos in the fitness industry, and trying to
tell these people anything is like talking to a brick wall.
My own personal crusade has been against supersonic step tempos and the
reverse turn as a step move.
The reverse turn is contraindicated (AFAA will fail anyone who uses a
contraindicated move during the practical portion of step specialty
certification exam.) I have thrown up my hand right in the middle of
presentations to demand an alternative for the reverse turn. "Just do
a regular turn" doesn't cut it, because that expects you to start out
facing a different direction and ends one up facing the wrong
direction. Most of the time I get the reaction "well it's an advanced
move, but my participants are advanced so they can do it just fine."
BS, it has nothing to do with _whether_ they can do it, it has
everything to do with the unnatural biomechanical demands of the move
no matter who's doing it.
I get upset when I attend fitness conferences where nationally-known
presenters use reverse turns and step music at 135+ BPM. (With a
digital metronome I have clocked presenters as high as 141 BPM!) These
people are supposed to know better and lead by example. Folks who
attend these conferences are earning CECs, so they come away with the
impression that the certifying organizations are saying it's okay to do
these things. Nothing could be further from the truth, but ACE and
AFAA can't monitor every presenter at every conference. A few years
ago after I wrote to ACE two years in a row about specific "violations"
by presenters at particular conference, they sent a representative to
spot-check the next one.
> If I give this guy a copy of fitness guidelines, with relevent points
> highlighted, he'll probably go postal. And this guy runs my gym, so he
> can expel me altogether.
Is he that much of a loose cannon? This isn't the kind of person who
should be running a corporate fitness center! I suggest that if he
were to do either of these, it should be immediately brought to his
manager's attention. Perhaps you should have your conversation in a
public-enough spot where there are sure to be witnesses.
> In short... maybe I can't get much constructive advice here, but at
> least I can vent.
I feel for ya.
--
Denise denise dot howard at comcast dot net
ACE and AFAA certified fitness instructor
AFAA step and kickboxing certified >> Stay informed about: Standards and Sloppage and Long-Time Instructors |
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Since: Feb 15, 2005 Posts: 46
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(Msg. 5) Posted: Sat Feb 19, 2005 7:00 pm
Post subject: Re: Standards and Sloppage and Long-Time Instructors [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Denise Howard wrote:
> In article <d1xRd.14156$D34.8042@newssvr12.news.prodigy.com>, Scott
> Eiler <seiler.TakeThisOut@eilertech.com> wrote:
>
>
>>How much more in
>>violation will I be after twenty years? How much more so, if I would
>>not listen to other fitness professionals?
>
> None, if you keep up on fitness trends and research. ACE's "Fitness
> Matters" newsletter is actually pretty decent for this purpose. Much
> better publication than AFAA's "American Fitness", which is pretty
> fluffy.
Indeed. AFAA's fitness tips sometimes read like ads for spas. I'll
have to check out an ACE membership, if not a certification.
> My own personal crusade has been against supersonic step tempos and the
> reverse turn as a step move.
>
> The reverse turn is contraindicated (AFAA will fail anyone who uses a
> contraindicated move during the practical portion of step specialty
> certification exam.)
I didn't know that, but now that I think about it, it's about as safe as
running up a stairway backward. And yes, this guy does reverse turns at
138 bpm.
>>If I give this guy a copy of fitness guidelines, with relevent points
>>highlighted, he'll probably go postal. And this guy runs my gym, so he
>>can expel me altogether.
>
> Is he that much of a loose cannon? This isn't the kind of person who
> should be running a corporate fitness center! I suggest that if he
> were to do either of these, it should be immediately brought to his
> manager's attention.
Assuming he has a manager instead of just being a franchisee, and
assuming I can track his line of command down; I've never seen them come
to visit.
> Perhaps you should have your conversation in a
> public-enough spot where there are sure to be witnesses.
I had the last one in front of all his employees. The silence from out
of them was deafening. As for the clientele, I doubt most of them are
ready to join in a fight about best practice.
--
-------- Scott Eiler B{D> -------- http://www.eilertech.com/ --------
"Men must be patient. Cattle are not reasoning beings. Remember that
this is the Home of Mothers. Treat each cow as a Mother should be
treated."
- Notice To The Help, from W.D. Hoard, founder of Hoard's Dairyman
Magazine. >> Stay informed about: Standards and Sloppage and Long-Time Instructors |
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