Pull-Ups vs. Bench Press formula

David wrote:
> "David Cohen" <sammiesdad.TakeThisOut@gmail.com> wrote
> > benn686.TakeThisOut@hotmail.com wrote:
> > > Im 180lbs and can bench quite a bit (I use a bowflex so I dont know
> > > exactly how much it is in free weights), but oddly enough, I cant even
> > > do a single pull-up.
> > >
> > > Isnt Bench Pressing and Pull-ups primarily using the same muscle
> > > (tricept)? Why are pull-ups so much harder? Anyone else experience
> > > this?
> >
> > Your knowledge of anatomy is, to say the least, lacking. Please go to
> > www.exrx.net and review the exercises and the muscle groups that they
> > use. That site will provide you with an eye-opening education.
> >
> > Study it for a few days, come back, and say thank you.
>
> Thank you??? Since when?? I read the rules that dickhead keeps trotting
> out - Rule#4 subsection 3C "at mfw good manners is a liability:"
> Has that changed now?

Yes, it has, thank you very much. So, if you wouldn't mind, please be
polite and kind at all times, if it wouldn't be too much trouble, thank
you.

Have a nice day.

David
the polite one, not you
 >> Stay informed about: Pull-Ups vs. Bench Press formula 

> Isnt Bench Pressing and Pull-ups primarily using the same muscle
No.

(tricept)? No

I am surprised by how many people do not know that muscles only contract or
relax. Bench pressing is a pushing motion; Pull-ups are a pulling motion.
Therefore they cannot both use the same muscles. When you curl/bend your
arm, you use the bicep, when you straighten your arm you use your tricep.
(not spelled "tricept" although many mispronounce it that way)

In addition, although you do use your tricep in the bench press, it is not
the primary muscle, unless you use a very close grip. The primary muscles
are your pectorals (chest muscles). In pull-ups or chin-ups you curl/bend
your arm, so that means you use your bicep. But you also bring your elbow
from away from your body to a point that is closer to your body, and that is
the function of the latissimus dorsi, or simply "lats". In a pull-up, the
only thing your tricep should be doing is relaxing so that your biceps and
lats can do their job without hindrance.


<benn686.TakeThisOut@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1120898707.792508.241420@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> Im 180lbs and can bench quite a bit (I use a bowflex so I dont know
> exactly how much it is in free weights), but oddly enough, I cant even
> do a single pull-up.
>
> Isnt Bench Pressing and Pull-ups primarily using the same muscle
> (tricept)? Why are pull-ups so much harder? Anyone else experience
> this?
>
 >> Stay informed about: Pull-Ups vs. Bench Press formula 

<benn686.TakeThisOut@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1120898707.792508.241420@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> Im 180lbs and can bench quite a bit (I use a bowflex so I dont know
> exactly how much it is in free weights), but oddly enough, I cant even
> do a single pull-up.
>
> Isnt Bench Pressing and Pull-ups primarily using the same muscle
> (tricept)? Why are pull-ups so much harder? Anyone else experience
> this?

Stop kiding yourself with the Blowflex, get some free weights.
 >> Stay informed about: Pull-Ups vs. Bench Press formula 

"ATP*" <eugene DeleteThis @ogedin.com> wrote in message
news:5UOze.1493$IU1.1104@fe11.lga...
>
> <benn686 DeleteThis @hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1120898707.792508.241420@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>> Im 180lbs and can bench quite a bit (I use a bowflex so I dont know
>> exactly how much it is in free weights), but oddly enough, I cant even
>> do a single pull-up.
>>
>> Isnt Bench Pressing and Pull-ups primarily using the same muscle
>> (tricept)? Why are pull-ups so much harder? Anyone else experience
>> this?
>
> Stop kiding yourself with the Blowflex, get some free weights.
that would be kidding
 >> Stay informed about: Pull-Ups vs. Bench Press formula 

"David Cohen" <sammiesdad RemoveThis @gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1120901893.081322.295790@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>
>
> benn686 RemoveThis @hotmail.com wrote:
> > Im 180lbs and can bench quite a bit (I use a bowflex so I dont know
> > exactly how much it is in free weights), but oddly enough, I cant even
> > do a single pull-up.
> >
> > Isnt Bench Pressing and Pull-ups primarily using the same muscle
> > (tricept)? Why are pull-ups so much harder? Anyone else experience
> > this?
>
> Your knowledge of anatomy is, to say the least, lacking. Please go to
> www.exrx.net and review the exercises and the muscle groups that they
> use. That site will provide you with an eye-opening education.
>
> Study it for a few days, come back, and say thank you.
>
> David

Thank you??? Since when?? I read the rules that dickhead keeps trotting
out - Rule#4 subsection 3C "at mfw good manners is a liability:"
Has that changed now?
 >> Stay informed about: Pull-Ups vs. Bench Press formula 

"David Cohen" <sammiesdad.TakeThisOut@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1120903860.608615.170040@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
>
>
> David wrote:
> > "David Cohen" <sammiesdad.TakeThisOut@gmail.com> wrote
> > > benn686.TakeThisOut@hotmail.com wrote:
> > > > Im 180lbs and can bench quite a bit (I use a bowflex so I dont know
> > > > exactly how much it is in free weights), but oddly enough, I cant
even
> > > > do a single pull-up.
> > > >
> > > > Isnt Bench Pressing and Pull-ups primarily using the same muscle
> > > > (tricept)? Why are pull-ups so much harder? Anyone else experience
> > > > this?
> > >
> > > Your knowledge of anatomy is, to say the least, lacking. Please go to
> > > www.exrx.net and review the exercises and the muscle groups that they
> > > use. That site will provide you with an eye-opening education.
> > >
> > > Study it for a few days, come back, and say thank you.
> >
> > Thank you??? Since when?? I read the rules that dickhead keeps trotting
> > out - Rule#4 subsection 3C "at mfw good manners is a liability:"
> > Has that changed now?
>
> Yes, it has, thank you very much. So, if you wouldn't mind, please be
> polite and kind at all times, if it wouldn't be too much trouble, thank
> you.
>
> Have a nice day.
>
> David
> the polite one, not you

Yes I most certainly will. (Soon as I stop laughing).

David
(me, not the one who pulls legs)
 >> Stay informed about: Pull-Ups vs. Bench Press formula 

In article <1120903860.608615.170040.DeleteThis@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
"David Cohen" <sammiesdad.DeleteThis@gmail.com> wrote:

> David wrote:
> > "David Cohen" <sammiesdad.DeleteThis@gmail.com> wrote
> > > benn686.DeleteThis@hotmail.com wrote:
> > > > Im 180lbs and can bench quite a bit (I use a bowflex so I dont know
> > > > exactly how much it is in free weights), but oddly enough, I cant even
> > > > do a single pull-up.
> > > >
> > > > Isnt Bench Pressing and Pull-ups primarily using the same muscle
> > > > (tricept)? Why are pull-ups so much harder? Anyone else experience
> > > > this?
> > >
> > > Your knowledge of anatomy is, to say the least, lacking. Please go to
> > > www.exrx.net and review the exercises and the muscle groups that they
> > > use. That site will provide you with an eye-opening education.
> > >
> > > Study it for a few days, come back, and say thank you.
> >
> > Thank you??? Since when?? I read the rules that dickhead keeps trotting
> > out - Rule#4 subsection 3C "at mfw good manners is a liability:"
> > Has that changed now?
>
> Yes, it has, thank you very much. So, if you wouldn't mind, please be
> polite and kind at all times, if it wouldn't be too much trouble, thank
> you.
>
> Have a nice day.

Are you thinking of moving to Canada?

--
Keith
 >> Stay informed about: Pull-Ups vs. Bench Press formula 

benn686 wrote:

> Im 180lbs and can bench quite a bit (I use a bowflex so I dont know
> exactly how much it is in free weights), but oddly enough, I cant even
> do a single pull-up.
>
> Isnt Bench Pressing and Pull-ups primarily using the same muscle
> (tricept)?

No! Gee, you can't feel the main muscles these exercises work. Maybe
it's bad form or something..

> Why are pull-ups so much harder?

Your upper back and maybe biceps are weak. Or the bowflex lies.

You need to do some reading.
http://www.exrx.net/Lists/Directory.html
http://www.weighttrainersunited.com/directory.html
http://www.theministryoffitness.com/exercises.htm
http://webster.commnet.edu/grammar/marks/apostrophe.htm
 >> Stay informed about: Pull-Ups vs. Bench Press formula 

jeff wrote:

>>Isnt Bench Pressing and Pull-ups primarily using the same muscle
>> (tricept)? No
>
> I am surprised by how many people do not know that muscles only contract or
> relax. Bench pressing is a pushing motion; Pull-ups are a pulling motion.
> Therefore they cannot both use the same muscles. When you curl/bend your
> arm, you use the bicep, when you straighten your arm you use your tricep.
> (not spelled "tricept" although many mispronounce it that way)

That's largely true. But the long head of the tricep crosses the shoulder.
It does have some involvement in pulldown/pullover movements.
 >> Stay informed about: Pull-Ups vs. Bench Press formula 

In article <11cvu0nqgglqa34.RemoveThis@corp.supernews.com>,
Jeff Finlayson <finlayson.RemoveThis@hiwaaay.not> wrote:

> jeff wrote:
>
> >>Isnt Bench Pressing and Pull-ups primarily using the same muscle
> >> (tricept)? No
> >
> > I am surprised by how many people do not know that muscles only contract or
> > relax. Bench pressing is a pushing motion; Pull-ups are a pulling motion.
> > Therefore they cannot both use the same muscles. When you curl/bend your
> > arm, you use the bicep, when you straighten your arm you use your tricep.
> > (not spelled "tricept" although many mispronounce it that way)
>
> That's largely true. But the long head of the tricep crosses the shoulder.
> It does have some involvement in pulldown/pullover movements.

Right. Also they work together to create movement at the joint. So a
highly skilled bench presser inhibits activation of the antogonists, for
example. So there is an element of 'involvement' in terms of inhibition.

Movement is complex. Tougher than math. :^)

--
Keith
 >> Stay informed about: Pull-Ups vs. Bench Press formula 

Hobbes <khobman800.RemoveThis@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> Jeff Finlayson <finlayson.RemoveThis@hiwaaay.not> wrote:
>>
>> jeff wrote:
>>
>> >>Isnt Bench Pressing and Pull-ups primarily using the same muscle
>> >> (tricept)? No
>> >
>> > I am surprised by how many people do not know that muscles only contract or
>> > relax. Bench pressing is a pushing motion; Pull-ups are a pulling motion.
>> > Therefore they cannot both use the same muscles. When you curl/bend your
>> > arm, you use the bicep, when you straighten your arm you use your tricep.
>> > (not spelled "tricept" although many mispronounce it that way)
>>
>> That's largely true. But the long head of the tricep crosses the shoulder.
>> It does have some involvement in pulldown/pullover movements.
>
>Right. Also they work together to create movement at the joint. So a
>highly skilled bench presser inhibits activation of the antogonists, for
>example. So there is an element of 'involvement' in terms of inhibition.

However, in terms of ballistic lifting, which you now lean toward,
concurrent training of antagonists has been found beneficial to
development of power.
 >> Stay informed about: Pull-Ups vs. Bench Press formula 

In article <jb50d11kdtnkdc8j2u1d7u0f5vs8j6ekgf RemoveThis @4ax.com>,
JMW <jmw RemoveThis @event.horizon> wrote:

> Hobbes <khobman800 RemoveThis @yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> > Jeff Finlayson <finlayson RemoveThis @hiwaaay.not> wrote:
> >>
> >> jeff wrote:
> >>
> >> >>Isnt Bench Pressing and Pull-ups primarily using the same muscle
> >> >> (tricept)? No
> >> >
> >> > I am surprised by how many people do not know that muscles only contract
> >> > or
> >> > relax. Bench pressing is a pushing motion; Pull-ups are a pulling
> >> > motion.
> >> > Therefore they cannot both use the same muscles. When you curl/bend
> >> > your
> >> > arm, you use the bicep, when you straighten your arm you use your
> >> > tricep.
> >> > (not spelled "tricept" although many mispronounce it that way)
> >>
> >> That's largely true. But the long head of the tricep crosses the
> >> shoulder.
> >> It does have some involvement in pulldown/pullover movements.
> >
> >Right. Also they work together to create movement at the joint. So a
> >highly skilled bench presser inhibits activation of the antogonists, for
> >example. So there is an element of 'involvement' in terms of inhibition.
>
> However, in terms of ballistic lifting, which you now lean toward,
> concurrent training of antagonists has been found beneficial to
> development of power.

I'm not sure what you mean, John. Are you referring to 'balance' - ie.
training the row to assist the bench? If so, is the antogonistic
movement also done ballistically? I hate asking, but are you referencing
a particular study? I haven't come across this, to be honest.

I've seen studies where they find as motor skills increase in a simple,
single joint movement antagonist activation decreases. I've also heard
from speculation by some pretty qualified people that this skill also
occurs in complex movements. And there is one study on the power clean
that appears to support this position.

I have to admit - I can see someone supporting this with the bench
press, but I might question cause and effect. The reality is the back
muscles are quite strongly involved in both stablization and driving off
the chest. So I'm not sure it is the antogonist 'balance' which helps
power in the bench as much as having strong and large lats to drive off
the chest.

Your thoughts?

--
Keith
 >> Stay informed about: Pull-Ups vs. Bench Press formula 

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