Welcome to TheFitnessForum.net!
FAQFAQ   SearchSearch      ProfileProfile    Private MessagesPrivate Messages   Log inLog in

Good info here but really, where should I start? A Newbie

 
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4
   Fitness Forums (Home) -> Beginner Weight Training RSS
Related Topics:
Advice needed - newbie - Hello everyone I was just after a little advice really, there seems to be so much on the web, but I figured it would be better getting info from the horses mouth, so to speak. :) I'd like to develop my upper body somewhat, I'm fairly slim at the moment.

[newbie] protein bar as food - I am trying to eat food more often but I don't want the trouble of carrying food to work. Does it make sense for me to eat protein bar late in the

Advice for newbie with tired muscles? - I'm 37, 5' 10" and 186lbs. About 5 weeks ago, I was about 205lbs and wanted to get into some kind of shape after doing nothing about it my whole life. I changed my diet and started on the treadmill and using weights (all done at home). I..

My beginner workout routine good? - I started lifting weights about a month ago, and I have asked for advice from my friends and I wanted to know if what I am doing is correct. A typical week at the gym looks like this: (a rep about equal to 10 tries) Monday: 10 min run to warm up, 3..

Overweight, Thick as Pig Shit Newbie seeks Advice(lite-hea.. - I am as described in the header, but I'm making progress. My question is this: Back when I last worked out (and that Austrian guy was going for win #7 - yes, that long ago) I am SURE the process was, in EACH session -- Lift your MAX to failure..
Next:  1003 lbs Deadlift!  
Author Message
Andrzej Rosa

External


Since: Oct 29, 2005
Posts: 614



(Msg. 46) Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 10:55 am
Post subject: Re: Good info here but really, where should I start? A Newbie [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: misc>fitness>weights (more info?)

Dnia 2007-01-14 Andrzej Rosa napisał(a):
> Dnia 2007-01-14 Tom Anderson napisał(a):
>> On Sat, 13 Jan 2007, Andrzej Rosa wrote:
>>
>>
>> It depends. It might be more convenient to only be working out three days
>> a week - less sweaty clothes to wash,
>
> While training at home you have no public to judge you badly if your
> gym clothes are smelly, so you can "safely" change into your sweaty
> workout clothes. Wink
>
>> more days where i'm not worn out,
>
> With high frequency workouts you spread the load more evenly over a
> week, so you shouldn't be worn out on your gym days. Your workouts are
> also shorter, so it's not as much of stress.
>
>> etc. But then it might be less convenient - more days means shorter
>> workouts, which means getting to work or to bed sooner. In fact, i've
>> recently switched to a split routine for exactly that reason.
>
> Well, so we do not disagree here after all? Good. If OP is still
> reading he should feel less confused. Wink

I just stumbled on Charles Poliquin opinion on exactly the same topic,
so I thought I'll paste it here:

http://www.t-nation.com/readTopic.do;jsessionid=5EF846388B2875C5E9F2E4...06B13DF
#v+
Total Body vs. Body Part Splits... Again

Q: Some T-Nation coaches advocate training the whole body in one
session; others usually use a body part split of some sort. The debate
is endless, but I'd love to hear your thoughts on it!

A: I'm the first one to want to improve on any training system, but I
do not know anyone successful in the strength coaching business who
uses full body routines exclusively.

I've trained Olympic medalists in sixteen different sports, from energy
system sports such as swimming to short-term explosive power sports
such as shot put. For almost every single one of them, 70% of the time,
I've used split routines and switched to whole body routines as their
competition was nearing. Whether it's Adam Nelson who won the World
Championship in the shot put or Dwight Phillips who won it in the long
jump, they all trained with split routines.

Workouts have to be short and effective, and when you train for
relative strength you have to do a lot of sets. If you do a lot of
sets, you can't do a lot of exercises. Athletes need split training
to get adequate recovery.

Adam Nelson's split looked like this:
Day 1: Chest/back
Day 2: Legs
Day 3: Off
Day 4: Rotator cuff and arms
Day 5: Off

Adam, by the way, incline benches 525 pounds using a fat, three inch
bar.

In bodybuilding, I don't think Ronnie Coleman trains whole body
three days a week. I've never known a successful bodybuilder, even
the low set guys like Dorian Yates, to do whole body training.

The key is to recruit as many motor units as possible, and you have
to think about the law of exercise order. There have been a few
good studies done on this, but here's the Reader's Digest version:

If you have a group of lifters who do exercises A, B, C, and D in a
workout, and you have a group do the same exercises in the reverse
order (D, C, B, and A), what you find is that the first group makes
the most progress on exercise A and the second group makes the most
progress on exercise D. Basically, you'll make the most progress on
whatever you do first.

I've always found that when you get to the elite level, most
athletes do best just doing two primary exercises per workout using
multiple sets (like ten), and then training again six hours later.
Every single Olympian I've trained used split routines. I've been
in this profession for 26 years and no one has ever convinced me,
by their results, that full body routines are the only way to go.

Having coached at three different Olympics, I've had the
opportunity to talk shop with many successful colleagues. Whether
they were from Norway, Germany, or Finland, they all came to the
conclusion that split routines were far more advantageous than
total body routines.
#v-

--
Andrzej Rosa 1127R

 >> Stay informed about: Good info here but really, where should I start? A Newbie 
Back to top
Login to vote
DZ

External


Since: Jan 15, 2007
Posts: 1



(Msg. 47) Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2007 8:40 pm
Post subject: Re: Good info here but really, where should I start? A Newbie [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Imported from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

This message is not archived

 >> Stay informed about: Good info here but really, where should I start? A Newbie 
Back to top
Login to vote
DZ

External


Since: Jan 15, 2007
Posts: 1



(Msg. 48) Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2007 9:03 pm
Post subject: Re: Good info here but really, where should I start? A Newbie [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Imported from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Back to top
Login to vote
Andrzej Rosa

External


Since: Oct 29, 2005
Posts: 614



(Msg. 49) Posted: Tue Jan 16, 2007 6:21 am
Post subject: Re: Good info here but really, where should I start? A Newbie [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Dnia 2007-01-15 DZ napisał(a):
> Andrzej Rosa <bakters.TakeThisOut@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> I just stumbled on Charles Poliquin opinion on exactly the same topic,
>> so I thought I'll paste it here:
>>
>> http://www.t-nation.com/readTopic.do;jsessionid=5EF846388B2875C5E9F2E4...06B13DF
>> #v+
>> Total Body vs. Body Part Splits... Again
>>
>> Q: Some T-Nation coaches advocate training the whole body in one
>> session; others usually use a body part split of some sort. The debate
>> is endless, but I'd love to hear your thoughts on it!
>>
>> A: I'm the first one to want to improve on any training system, but I
>> do not know anyone successful in the strength coaching business who
>> uses full body routines exclusively.
>
> This can probably be re-phrased as
>
> "I do not know anyone successful in the strength coaching business who
> uses split routines exclusively."

Is it rephrasing? It looks verbatim enough for me.

> Also, workouts that people call "full body" don't necessarily put the
> same emphasis on all exercises, or have exactly the same exercises in
> every workout, so the distinction between the two approaches is not
> always clear.
>
> How would you call the Sheiko routine where athletes bench press 5
> days a week using multiple sets? Surely it is not a true split.

Of course it's not a classic bodybuilding body-part split, but it's a
split of sorts. Similar to what some Oly lifters would use. With
high frequency, one would generally do better by switching focus from
workout to workout, so it can be called a split.

>> I've trained Olympic medalists in sixteen different sports, from
>> energy system sports such as swimming to short-term explosive power
>> sports such as shot put. For almost every single one of them, 70% of
>> the time, I've used split routines and switched to whole body
>> routines as their competition was nearing.
>
> Another point to be made is that goals of a competitive athlete are
> not the same as those of someone like me. By goals I don't mean goals
> within strength/fitness/etc definitions but simply the fact that
> unlike the goals of Olympic athletes, mine would be secondary to other
> pursuits. So, there is an issue of an optimal routine to cram into a
> limited time slot I'm willing to spend in a day.

Sure. But that was my point too. I assumed something and prescribed a
program based on those assumptions, noting that if they are far from
true, I'll be wrong. With lower frequency of training sessions,
splitting hairs will not work well.

--
Andrzej Rosa 1127R
 >> Stay informed about: Good info here but really, where should I start? A Newbie 
Back to top
Login to vote
DZ

External


Since: Jan 16, 2007
Posts: 1



(Msg. 50) Posted: Tue Jan 16, 2007 12:21 pm
Post subject: Re: Good info here but really, where should I start? A Newbie [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Imported from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Back to top
Login to vote
Andrzej Rosa

External


Since: Oct 29, 2005
Posts: 614



(Msg. 51) Posted: Tue Jan 16, 2007 2:20 pm
Post subject: Re: Good info here but really, where should I start? A Newbie [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Dnia 2007-01-16 DZ napisał(a):
> Andrzej Rosa <bakters DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote:
>> Dnia 2007-01-15 DZ napisał(a):
>>> Another point to be made is that goals of a competitive athlete are
>>> not the same as those of someone like me. By goals I don't mean goals
>>> within strength/fitness/etc definitions but simply the fact that
>>> unlike the goals of Olympic athletes, mine would be secondary to other
>>> pursuits. So, there is an issue of an optimal routine to cram into a
>>> limited time slot I'm willing to spend in a day.
>>
>> Sure. But that was my point too. I assumed something and prescribed a
>> program based on those assumptions, noting that if they are far from
>> true, I'll be wrong. With lower frequency of training sessions,
>> splitting hairs will not work well.
>
> To split hairs means to argue about particularities that are not
> really important with regard to the issue at hand Smile

Hmm, doesn't it sum up a big part of mfw content? I'd swear that it may
apply at times. Wink

> My training frequency is every day. I usually start at about 10 pm and
> go on for 40-60 min, but in practice I end up skipping about a day a
> week.

I used a two day split before this stupid flu, and also worked with
similar frequency, but to be honest I don't think that even with this
split I maximised my muscular development. I think that a three day
split would be better for this purpose. Using this I could train with
higher intensity on average, because my muscles would have a longer
time to recover between workouts. Do you think that full body workouts
done daily are optimal from a muscular development's point of view?

--
Andrzej Rosa 1127R
 >> Stay informed about: Good info here but really, where should I start? A Newbie 
Back to top
Login to vote
DZ

External


Since: Jan 16, 2007
Posts: 1



(Msg. 52) Posted: Tue Jan 16, 2007 2:20 pm
Post subject: Re: Good info here but really, where should I start? A Newbie [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Imported from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Back to top
Login to vote
Display posts from previous:   
   Fitness Forums (Home) -> Beginner Weight Training All times are: Pacific Time (US & Canada) (change)
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4
Page 4 of 4

 
You can post new topics in this forum
You can reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum



[ Contact us | Terms of Service/Privacy Policy ]