Benefits of Hypertrophy training for fat loss and osteopor..

Donovan Rebbechi wrote:
>
> The routine itself burns calories. Also increases BMR since lean mass

> increases. Also, putting on lean mass in itself increases caloric
> requirements.

Not as much as most people think, only 6 Cal/lb muscle.
It would take a 10 lb muscle gain to burn 1/2 a banana.

The calore burning effect of muscle in correctly overestimated in the
popular press.

Randy F
 >> Stay informed about: Benefits of Hypertrophy training for fat loss and osteopor.. 

<randy.RemoveThis@val.com> wrote in message
news:1115441520.507753.315600@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
>
> Donovan Rebbechi wrote:
>>
>> The routine itself burns calories. Also increases BMR since lean mass
>
>> increases. Also, putting on lean mass in itself increases caloric
>> requirements.
>
> Not as much as most people think, only 6 Cal/lb muscle.
> It would take a 10 lb muscle gain to burn 1/2 a banana.
>
> The calore burning effect of muscle in correctly overestimated in the
> popular press.

Doesn't that depend upon how active you are? Without knowing
anything about it (luckily this is a newsgroup so I can voice an
opinion anyway ) it would seem to me that 20 lbs of muscle
working intensely for an hour would burn more calories than
10 lbs of muscle working intensely for an hour, and the difference
would be more than 1/2 a banana.

When I wrestled (and except for the heavyweights making the
weight division cutoff is important enough to make calorie intake
a concern) the suggested calory intake rose quite a bit as you
went up the weight divisions - something like from 3500 cal
for the lightest weights to 5000+ for the heavies. Since everyone
did the same intensity of workouts, and no one (again, except
for the folks on the heavy end) had any body fat so to speak of,
I'd guess that the difference in muscle mass was the reason.

-JS2
 >> Stay informed about: Benefits of Hypertrophy training for fat loss and osteopor.. 

100% Isento De Toxinas wrote:
> Also what is the benefit of hypertrophy training for people with
> osteoporosis? Does hypertrophy training help calcium to "latch on"


Has nothing to do with calcium absorbtion.
Weightbearing exercise increases bone density (bones respond to
pressure by adding osteoblasts, or bone-forming cells, which boosts
density) which in turn helps prevent osteoporosis, or if you already
have it may help hinder its progress. http://tinyurl.com/d8e2b


joni
 >> Stay informed about: Benefits of Hypertrophy training for fat loss and osteopor.. 

"joni" <jgrrl2 DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote:

>
>100% Isento De Toxinas wrote:
>> Also what is the benefit of hypertrophy training for people with
>> osteoporosis? Does hypertrophy training help calcium to "latch on"
>
>
>Has nothing to do with calcium absorbtion.
>Weightbearing exercise increases bone density (bones respond to
>pressure by adding osteoblasts, or bone-forming cells, which boosts
>density) which in turn helps prevent osteoporosis, or if you already
>have it may help hinder its progress. http://tinyurl.com/d8e2b

What you and the article referred by that URL call "weight-bearing"
exercises do not create significant hypertrophy. Those exercises
might be better described as "impact exercises." Impact exercise
promotes improved bone mineral density.

Muscular hypertrophy results from resistance training. Resistance
training results in some improvement in bone mineral density (BMD),
but not nearly as much as impact exercise.

I don't like cardio, but I do it because I should. When I do cardio,
I prefer an elliptical trainer, but half the time I use the
less-preferred treadmill because it provides impact exercise. If not
for the combined benefit of cardiovascular fitness and improving
(BMD), I would never use a treadmill. However, resistance training
alone is not really adequate to provide optimal BMD, particularly not
in someone with osteoporosis.

--

JMW
http://www.rustyiron.net
 >> Stay informed about: Benefits of Hypertrophy training for fat loss and osteopor.. 

"JMW" <jmw RemoveThis @event.horizon> wrote in message news:rr1q71dkad1qet0iaga8pk3u7ut4p46ep0@4ax.com...
> "joni" <jgrrl2 RemoveThis @yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >
> >100% Isento De Toxinas wrote:
> >> Also what is the benefit of hypertrophy training for people with
> >> osteoporosis? Does hypertrophy training help calcium to "latch on"
> >
> >
> >Has nothing to do with calcium absorbtion.
> >Weightbearing exercise increases bone density (bones respond to
> >pressure by adding osteoblasts, or bone-forming cells, which boosts
> >density) which in turn helps prevent osteoporosis, or if you already
> >have it may help hinder its progress. http://tinyurl.com/d8e2b
>
> What you and the article referred by that URL call "weight-bearing"
> exercises do not create significant hypertrophy. Those exercises
> might be better described as "impact exercises." Impact exercise
> promotes improved bone mineral density.
>
> Muscular hypertrophy results from resistance training. Resistance
> training results in some improvement in bone mineral density (BMD),
> but not nearly as much as impact exercise.
>

While I would expect this, I've never seen a decent study. Do you
know of any that compare the two types of exercises?

> I don't like cardio, but I do it because I should. When I do cardio,
> I prefer an elliptical trainer, but half the time I use the
> less-preferred treadmill because it provides impact exercise. If not
> for the combined benefit of cardiovascular fitness and improving
> (BMD), I would never use a treadmill. However, resistance training
> alone is not really adequate to provide optimal BMD, particularly not
> in someone with osteoporosis.
>

Keep in mind that treadmills are designed to absorb some of the impact
in order to protect runner's knees. Walking on a track might be better.

> --
>
> JMW
> http://www.rustyiron.net

Art
 >> Stay informed about: Benefits of Hypertrophy training for fat loss and osteopor.. 

"Art S" <thedabbler02.RemoveThis@earthlink.net> wrote:
>"JMW" <jmw.RemoveThis@event.horizon> wrote:
>> "joni" <jgrrl2.RemoveThis@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >100% Isento De Toxinas wrote:
>> >> Also what is the benefit of hypertrophy training for people with
>> >> osteoporosis? Does hypertrophy training help calcium to "latch on"
>> >
>> >
>> >Has nothing to do with calcium absorbtion.
>> >Weightbearing exercise increases bone density (bones respond to
>> >pressure by adding osteoblasts, or bone-forming cells, which boosts
>> >density) which in turn helps prevent osteoporosis, or if you already
>> >have it may help hinder its progress. http://tinyurl.com/d8e2b
>>
>> What you and the article referred by that URL call "weight-bearing"
>> exercises do not create significant hypertrophy. Those exercises
>> might be better described as "impact exercises." Impact exercise
>> promotes improved bone mineral density.
>>
>> Muscular hypertrophy results from resistance training. Resistance
>> training results in some improvement in bone mineral density (BMD),
>> but not nearly as much as impact exercise.
>
>While I would expect this, I've never seen a decent study. Do you
>know of any that compare the two types of exercises?

C'mon, Art, you must not be looking very hard:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&d...=Abstra
(http://tinyurl.com/74ka7)

Here is a chart from that article comparing well-trained gymnasts with
well-trained swimmers and a control group:

http://www.jbmr-online.org/fulltext/01202/02550/JBMR0120202550T02_mag.gif
(http://tinyurl.com/bzgnc)

And note that "[b]ecause all athletes underwent resistance training
throughout the year of study, muscle strengthening activity did not
appear to be a significant factor in the skeletal response observed in
gymnasts."

>> I don't like cardio, but I do it because I should. When I do cardio,
>> I prefer an elliptical trainer, but half the time I use the
>> less-preferred treadmill because it provides impact exercise. If not
>> for the combined benefit of cardiovascular fitness and improving
>> (BMD), I would never use a treadmill. However, resistance training
>> alone is not really adequate to provide optimal BMD, particularly not
>> in someone with osteoporosis.
>>
>
>Keep in mind that treadmills are designed to absorb some of the impact
>in order to protect runner's knees. Walking on a track might be better.

That depends on your purpose. BMD increases based on the particular
area of impact for that type of activity:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&d...=Abstra
(http://tinyurl.com/dj295)

I'm happy with the treadmill.
--

JMW
http://www.rustyiron.net
 >> Stay informed about: Benefits of Hypertrophy training for fat loss and osteopor.. 

"JMW" <jmw DeleteThis @event.horizon> wrote in message news:2laq71l1vgr4dml84kpuu0h3o4piobjaue@4ax.com...
> "Art S" <thedabbler02 DeleteThis @earthlink.net> wrote:
> >"JMW" <jmw DeleteThis @event.horizon> wrote:
> >> "joni" <jgrrl2 DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >100% Isento De Toxinas wrote:
> >> >> Also what is the benefit of hypertrophy training for people with
> >> >> osteoporosis? Does hypertrophy training help calcium to "latch on"
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >Has nothing to do with calcium absorbtion.
> >> >Weightbearing exercise increases bone density (bones respond to
> >> >pressure by adding osteoblasts, or bone-forming cells, which boosts
> >> >density) which in turn helps prevent osteoporosis, or if you already
> >> >have it may help hinder its progress. http://tinyurl.com/d8e2b
> >>
> >> What you and the article referred by that URL call "weight-bearing"
> >> exercises do not create significant hypertrophy. Those exercises
> >> might be better described as "impact exercises." Impact exercise
> >> promotes improved bone mineral density.
> >>
> >> Muscular hypertrophy results from resistance training. Resistance
> >> training results in some improvement in bone mineral density (BMD),
> >> but not nearly as much as impact exercise.
> >
> >While I would expect this, I've never seen a decent study. Do you
> >know of any that compare the two types of exercises?
>
> C'mon, Art, you must not be looking very hard:
>
>
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&d...=Abstra
> (http://tinyurl.com/74ka7)
>
> Here is a chart from that article comparing well-trained gymnasts with
> well-trained swimmers and a control group:
>
> http://www.jbmr-online.org/fulltext/01202/02550/JBMR0120202550T02_mag.gif
> (http://tinyurl.com/bzgnc)
>
> And note that "[b]ecause all athletes underwent resistance training
> throughout the year of study, muscle strengthening activity did not
> appear to be a significant factor in the skeletal response observed in
> gymnasts."
>

I think you misunderstood me.

I expect high impact activities to result in higher bone density than weight
lifting. (At least at the level of weights that most people would be able to
lift). I haven't seen a study comparing the two. The article you cite
doesn't compare gymnastics to weight lifting - it compares gymnastics
to swimming (low impact) and running (medium impact? high impact?
lower than gymnastics, in any case).

> >> I don't like cardio, but I do it because I should. When I do cardio,
> >> I prefer an elliptical trainer, but half the time I use the
> >> less-preferred treadmill because it provides impact exercise. If not
> >> for the combined benefit of cardiovascular fitness and improving
> >> (BMD), I would never use a treadmill. However, resistance training
> >> alone is not really adequate to provide optimal BMD, particularly not
> >> in someone with osteoporosis.
> >>
> >
> >Keep in mind that treadmills are designed to absorb some of the impact
> >in order to protect runner's knees. Walking on a track might be better.
>
> That depends on your purpose. BMD increases based on the particular
> area of impact for that type of activity:
>
>
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&d...=Abstra
> (http://tinyurl.com/dj295)
>
> I'm happy with the treadmill.

My point was that, since most treadmills are designed to absorb some
of the impact, there will be more skeletal impact from someone walking
on a track (or sidewalk) than from walking on the treadmill. As a
result, if the goal is to increase BMD then walking on a track or on the
sidewalk is probably better than walking on a treadmill.

If you're happy with the treadmill, keep it up.

Art
 >> Stay informed about: Benefits of Hypertrophy training for fat loss and osteopor.. 

"Art S" <thedabbler02 RemoveThis @earthlink.net> wrote:
>
>"JMW" <jmw RemoveThis @event.horizon> wrote in message news:2laq71l1vgr4dml84kpuu0h3o4piobjaue@4ax.com...
>>
>> And note that "[b]ecause all athletes underwent resistance training
>> throughout the year of study, muscle strengthening activity did not
>> appear to be a significant factor in the skeletal response observed in
>> gymnasts."
>
>I think you misunderstood me.
>
>I expect high impact activities to result in higher bone density than weight
>lifting. (At least at the level of weights that most people would be able to
>lift). I haven't seen a study comparing the two. The article you cite
>doesn't compare gymnastics to weight lifting - it compares gymnastics
>to swimming (low impact) and running (medium impact? high impact?
>lower than gymnastics, in any case).

I'm not sure what you mean. If you mean resistance training with no
other activity, as opposed to high-impact exercise with no other
activity, I haven't seen a head-to-head study, and you may not find
that amongst studies of athletes. In the study I cited, all athletes
engaged in resistance training, but some engaged in high-impact
sports, while others engaged in low-impact sports. I can produce a
study that shows high-intensity weight training stimulates BMD and
does so better that low-intensity weight training, and this one
establishes that high-impact exercise, in addition to resistance
training, stimulates BMD even more than low-impact exercise in
addition to resistance training. I'm not sure what more you want to
be convinced.
--

JMW
http://www.rustyiron.net
 >> Stay informed about: Benefits of Hypertrophy training for fat loss and osteopor.. 

"JMW" <jmw.DeleteThis@event.horizon> wrote
> "Art S" <thedabbler02.DeleteThis@earthlink.net> wrote:
>>"JMW" <jmw.DeleteThis@event.horizon> wrote >>>
>>> And note that "[b]ecause all athletes underwent resistance training
>>> throughout the year of study, muscle strengthening activity did not
>>> appear to be a significant factor in the skeletal response observed in
>>> gymnasts."
>>
>>I think you misunderstood me.
>>
>>I expect high impact activities to result in higher bone density than
>>weight
>>lifting. (At least at the level of weights that most people would be able
>>to
>>lift). I haven't seen a study comparing the two. The article you cite
>>doesn't compare gymnastics to weight lifting - it compares gymnastics
>>to swimming (low impact) and running (medium impact? high impact?
>>lower than gymnastics, in any case).
>
> I'm not sure what you mean. If you mean resistance training with no
> other activity, as opposed to high-impact exercise with no other
> activity, I haven't seen a head-to-head study, and you may not find
> that amongst studies of athletes. In the study I cited, all athletes
> engaged in resistance training, but some engaged in high-impact
> sports, while others engaged in low-impact sports. I can produce a
> study that shows high-intensity weight training stimulates BMD and
> does so better that low-intensity weight training, and this one
> establishes that high-impact exercise, in addition to resistance
> training, stimulates BMD even more than low-impact exercise in
> addition to resistance training. I'm not sure what more you want to

<<joni>> disagreeing with you would convince me. There is no higher
standard.

David
 >> Stay informed about: Benefits of Hypertrophy training for fat loss and osteopor.. 

"JMW" <jmw.TakeThisOut@event.horizon> wrote in message news:ur1r71l2al8jcfjj5b4haf8ibu9o5t5g14@4ax.com...
> "Art S" <thedabbler02.TakeThisOut@earthlink.net> wrote:
> >
> >"JMW" <jmw.TakeThisOut@event.horizon> wrote in message news:2laq71l1vgr4dml84kpuu0h3o4piobjaue@4ax.com...
> >>
> >> And note that "[b]ecause all athletes underwent resistance training
> >> throughout the year of study, muscle strengthening activity did not
> >> appear to be a significant factor in the skeletal response observed in
> >> gymnasts."
> >
> >I think you misunderstood me.
> >
> >I expect high impact activities to result in higher bone density than weight
> >lifting. (At least at the level of weights that most people would be able to
> >lift). I haven't seen a study comparing the two. The article you cite
> >doesn't compare gymnastics to weight lifting - it compares gymnastics
> >to swimming (low impact) and running (medium impact? high impact?
> >lower than gymnastics, in any case).
>
> I'm not sure what you mean. If you mean resistance training with no
> other activity, as opposed to high-impact exercise with no other
> activity, I haven't seen a head-to-head study, and you may not find
> that amongst studies of athletes.

That is exactly what I would like to see. As I said, I haven't seen one.

> In the study I cited, all athletes
> engaged in resistance training, but some engaged in high-impact
> sports, while others engaged in low-impact sports. I can produce a
> study that shows high-intensity weight training stimulates BMD and
> does so better that low-intensity weight training, and this one
> establishes that high-impact exercise, in addition to resistance
> training, stimulates BMD even more than low-impact exercise in
> addition to resistance training. I'm not sure what more you want to
> be convinced.

I don't need to be convinced that either can increase bone density.

What I would like is enough information to be able to tell an osteoparetic
woman something like: best is squatting 400 lbs, then gymnastics
(concentrating on activities with strong landings), then squatting 200
lbs, then jumping off of a 1' platform, etc. If a woman refuses to squat
more than 100 lbs ('cause she "doesn't want to grow big muscles"), is
it better to have her jump every day and forget the squatting? Or is
squatting 100 lbs the same as landing from 1' above the ground?

At the moment I can't relate jumping (or landing from) any height to
any level of weight lifting.

Art
 >> Stay informed about: Benefits of Hypertrophy training for fat loss and osteopor..